Ever set a goal, get excited, and then feel stuck before you even start?

In this episode of the Babies and Business Podcast, Avram and Rachel share a breakthrough insight from a recent leadership retreat that completely shifted how they approach setting realistic goals. A surprising exercise forced them to rethink how they identify their true starting point and why that matters more than most people realize.

If you’re tired of goals that feel inspiring at first but impossible later, this episode will help you understand what’s been missing and how to move forward with clarity.

Show Notes

Key Highlights from this Episode:

• Avram and Rachel share a powerful lesson from a leadership retreat exercise.

   

• Why knowing your true Point A matters more than you think.
• How unclear starting points lead to frustration, burnout, and unrealistic expectations.
• The difference between where you think you are vs where you actually are.
• How external feedback helps reveal blind spots and your real baseline.
• A practical example of finding Point A through personal finances.
• Why gathering real data (bank statements, spending categories) creates clarity.
• How tools like the Four Walls and envelope budgeting support realistic planning.
• Why your starting point influences every area of life — business, marriage, leadership, and personal growth.
• How combining self-reflection + real feedback helps you set realistic goals that stick.
• The importance of revisiting your Point A regularly, especially when planning a new year or new season.
  

Mentions & Resources

Dave Ramsey: The Four Walls — a budgeting principle popularized by Dave Ramsey that focuses on covering the four essentials first: housing, food, transportation, and utilities. This framework helps individuals establish a clear financial baseline before setting goals or planning expenses.

Goodbudget App — a digital envelope-style budgeting tool that helps users track spending, plan categories, and stay consistent with their financial goals. It allows you to allocate money into virtual “envelopes” and adjust them month by month based on real spending habits.

Law of the Vacuum — a principle mentioned by Avram and Rachel that suggests any space you create — whether physical, financial, or emotional — will naturally fill itself unless intentionally managed. This concept applies directly to money habits, spending, and goal setting.

Mentioned Episodes

Babies and Business EP 28 – How to Turn Goals into a Strategic Plan: An Inside Look

Babies and Business EP 66 – Rethinking New Year Goals

Babies and Business EP 87 – Are You Chasing the Right Goal?

Episode Transcription

Below you will find a transcript of this entire podcast episode. Enjoy!

Avram: Rachel and I were recently tossed into the woods with a group of strangers and a map that showed an X where our food supposedly was. The catch? The map didn’t show where we were starting. It was part of a leadership seminar, and we’ve already recorded a couple of podcasts about it. What stood out to us was how useless that map was until we figured out our actual starting point.

Rachel: It was fascinating — having a map, being with a group, trying to agree on where we were, gathering bits of information, and trying to get to point B. It’s a lot like life. You need to know where you’re starting from if you want to reach a goal. Just like with Google Maps — your destination alone isn’t enough. You need both points: where you want to go and where you truly are. And I’m excited to talk about how this applies to real life, especially finances.

Avram: We realized the exercise meant far more than we expected. The map showed bodies of water and some rough topography, but it wasn’t accurate enough to help us pinpoint our location early on. There were no roads, no clear landmarks — just enough to give a rough sense of the land.

Rachel: And that lack of clarity was intentional. Going through the experience, feeling the frustration, dealing with disagreements — it mimicked real life. Challenges don’t spread out over years; they were compressed into a few hours. You got to see your reactions instantly.

Avram: We started in daylight, but eventually it got dark. Some groups spent five hours searching before finally finding the cooler with our food. My group nearly missed it entirely and almost retraced our steps back to the lake just to try again. All of this highlighted the importance of knowing exactly where you are before you can get where you want to go. Personal finances are a perfect example of that.

Rachel: Absolutely. If you don’t know where you are financially, your goals will be out of reach. You’ll get discouraged, and you won’t know why nothing is working. You can’t create an action plan if you don’t know what you’re truly working with.

Avram: And numbers remove the guesswork — they tell the truth very clearly.

Rachel: The first thing I do when helping someone with their finances is pull three months of bank and credit card statements. That timeframe reveals monthly, quarterly, and annual expenses you may forget about. Then I categorize everything. Eating out is always eye-opening — most people have no idea how much they spend.

Avram: And you don’t just look at the total you spend each month. You go deeper — every dollar gets sorted into meaningful categories.

Rachel: Yes. If groceries and eating out live in the same category, you’ll never understand your habits. Once I categorize everything, I identify essentials only — using Dave Ramsey’s “four walls”: housing, food, transportation, and utilities. That gives you the bare minimum you need to survive.

Avram: And that’s only the first half of understanding your starting point.

Rachel: Right. After essentials, you list the things that matter to your lifestyle — things you want to keep. Then you figure out what’s flexible. Maybe you discover you’re spending a shocking amount eating out. So you set a cap. Maybe you decide on $50 a month, or whatever fits your goals.

Avram: Once you know your actual point A, it becomes so much easier to make intentional decisions for point B.

Rachel: Definitely. I use the GoodBudget app and the envelope system. Each category gets a set amount, and if a category runs low, I adjust. Over time, you see patterns — maybe groceries rise for three months in a row. That calls for attention. And when you’re dialed in, you can confidently set up things like a $500 monthly payment toward debt without fear of overdrawing or sabotaging yourself.

Avram: And the shocking categories really matter. Without the audit, we would have had a flimsy understanding of our spending. This applies beyond finances: we think we know our starting point in many areas — our strengths, weaknesses, opportunities — but until we do a real audit, we’re mostly guessing.

Rachel: I love that you brought up the leadership retreat. We graded ourselves on leadership qualities, then later the group gave us feedback. No one matched. Everyone either rated themselves higher or lower than how others perceived them. The truth was somewhere in between.

Avram: Exactly. There’s how you see yourself, and there’s how others see you. True point A is a combination of both.

Rachel: And sometimes we resist feedback. In business, we might believe our customer service is strong, but one-star reviews suggest otherwise. Instead of dismissing it, we can ask, “Where is this true?” Deep down, many of us already know where the weak spots are — we just haven’t acted.

x

Avram: Same with relationships. Think about movies where someone is shocked by divorce papers. Were they really blindsided? Or were the signs always there but unacknowledged?

Rachel: Exactly.

Avram: So if reaching your goals matters, it’s worth figuring out your real starting point — not the imagined one.

Rachel: Yes, 100%.

Avram: And with the new year coming up, we’ve got a series on goals — how to break them down, turn them into projects, and make them actionable. The episode we’re discussing today is the precursor to that. You can find the links in the show notes.

Rachel: There’s so much more we could add, but we’ll save that for another episode. Definitely check out the ones in the show notes if you want help figuring out your point A and your path to point B.

Avram: Next week, we’ll talk about feedback — a perfect follow-up. Thanks for listening to Episode 114 of the Babies and Business Podcast.

Rachel: Bye for now.